Better And Better

If you don't draw yours, I won't draw mine. A police officer, working in the small town that he lives in, focusing on family and shooting and coffee, and occasionally putting some people in jail.

Sunday, February 04, 2007

Subcaliber ammunition

I need to find me some insert adaptors.

See, there have been several times in my law enforcement career where I've needed to put down an animal in the city. Sometimes it's a rabid skunk. Sometimes it's a dog that's bitten someone for the last time. Occasionally it's a dog that has a "death warrant" issued. On one memorable occasion, my lieutenant had to put down a rogue emu that had been running in and out of traffic. (I can't make this stuff up, folks.) Or it might be an animal that's been struck by a car and needs to be put down. While of course we make sure that we have good backstops, people get worked up over identifiable gunfire, sometimes. Firing my pistol is LOUD. Firing my shotgun is LOUD. I don't carry around a .22 LR rifle, which would be the best solution in all probability.

But they make these little inserts. I've seen them advertised, and even recall a magazine article on 'em back in the 1980s. They're special adaptors to fire centerfire handgun ammunition through a shotgun. Well, in my car is an 870P shotgun with iron sights. If the thing is halfway accurate (say-- hits a pie plate 5 times out of 5 at 50 yards), then I see no problem with getting a .38 Special adaptor, and putting a 158g LSWHP in it, and euthanizing said critter with minimal fuss, and far less noise than a full shotgun blast or pistol report would give. My theory is that the shotgun barrel will act to suppress the report of the subcaliber round in it. This theory, of course, is absolutely untested. :)

But I can't find the dadgumed company or companies that make or distribute 'em!! All I've found so far is
this thing, which fires .410 caliber shells in a 12 gauge shotgun.
Hm. The price is fairly low. Perhaps I'll pick one up and try it with slugs. But it's still not precisely what I had in mind.

Anybody have a link or a phone number?

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At Sunday, February 04, 2007 8:21:00 PM, Blogger Matt G said...

An old thread (2003) of THR yielded "Dina Arms" as a supplier. A search brought up: "DINA ARMS CORPORATION

Address: PO BOX 46 ROYERSFORD , PA 19468 USA
Voice: 1- 610- 287- 0266 Fax: 1- 610- 287- 0266
Keywords: Shotgun, rifle, adapters, 44mag, 357mag, hunting, practice, training, shooting, guns."
Maybe I'll call 'em in the morning. But I know that there's other companies out there...

At Sunday, February 04, 2007 9:38:00 PM, Blogger Diamond Mair said...

Matt, I just posed your question to about 15 former Marines - I'm hoping they'll be getting back witchu soon ....................
Semper Fi'

At Sunday, February 04, 2007 11:19:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think E-Gunparts (Numrich), among others handles them, too. I'd suggest a .32 S&W short/long, .32ACP, or even .32H&R mag. or .30 carbine adapter for your 30-06.

I'll keep looking around. Shotgun News may have them in somebody's ad this week.

It might also be a good reason to get abother Buck Mark, though.


At Sunday, February 04, 2007 11:27:00 PM, Blogger Matt G said...

Rabbit, your suggestions are good, but I think that I want to get the shotshell adaptor, to try that bigger knockdown for less noise theory. Again, I may well be out of my tree on that concept, but if you can test a theory and scratch an itch for $30, why not?

And a .30 carbine out of my little '06 would still be pretty durn loud.

At Sunday, February 04, 2007 11:27:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Cabelas carries a 'chamber reducer' made of metal for various gauges, but they're a LOT more money than you need to spend. Search their online catalog.


At Sunday, February 04, 2007 11:33:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I just googled up several pistol caliber adapters, made of aluminum, for 12 gauge on Ebay by googling for '12 gauge shotgun to .38 adapter'. Price seems to run about $18 bucks.

Last post on this, I promise.

At Monday, February 05, 2007 12:13:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Seen this yet?

At Monday, February 05, 2007 8:23:00 AM, Blogger DW said...

I'm thinking the shotgun barrelwon't give a lot of supression unless its a contact shot. You might think about some light reloads. They would have to be clearly marked, no confusion to wind up somewhere they aren't wanted. Just some ideas.

At Monday, February 05, 2007 11:20:00 AM, Blogger Diamond Mair said...

Here are a couple suggestions from "my" Marines:

from Jack in CT
Depending on the state, he may be able to get a silencer through his department as some states allow the use of silencers on police weapons. I think the federal law against silencers excludes military and police.

from Ed in Dallas
The only ones I've ever seen-- and that was several years ago had a barrel as well.
Sure, it was a chamber insert, but about 2 feet long too. They went from .22LR, .38Spec. .44Spec and fitted inside any of the different guage shotgun barrels.
The .410 thing in a 12 guage will work, but the pattern, be it ever so small will be scattered out all over the place at 50 yards. And again, no chamber pressure or proper sized barrel to generate any speed. About the only thing I see those .410 inserts working in is a barrel chambered in .44Mag/Special
Shooting a regular centerfire round down a shotgun barrel?
I'd say that after about 3 feet, you won't even be able to guess which direction it will be heading in. But it'll be slow since the chamber insert will act like a 1/2 inch long barrel. The round won't have enough chamber pressure to get up any speed. A .38 will probably come out a little harder/faster than you could shoot one in a slingshot.
Remember- the barrel length is a major factor in determining velocity due to the pressures it lets the powder gases generate as it tries to confine them.
For what the guy wants to do, he'll just have to get some down loaded, cast wadcutter type bullet for his service pistol. Or, a light target load sort of shotgun shell. They'll still be loud, but less so that regular ammo.
If that's too much, about all that's left is bring Animal Control along on the call with a dart/tranquilizer rife.

Ed is an FFL-3 - if you'd like to get in touch with him, eMail me .................. my spousal unit suggests a Thompson Contender {but the cost may be prohibitive} because it can accomodate several calibers - alternatively, per my spouse, a plastic milk jug over the barrel of a .22 will offer 'silencing' .................
Though I hate when any animal has to be euthanized {except snakes - they can ALL go away, far as I'm concerned - I know, they have their purposes - they just need to stay away from ME!} I hope this is helpful ................. ;-)
BTW, no, I'm not crazy about hunting, but if one is a responsible hunter, and doesn't wound then leave animals to die horrible deaths, I can accept it .................. but people who don't know which end of the firearm to point, who don't know how to field dress, or who hunt merely for antlers on their walls or rugs under their feet are beyond contempt, to me ...................

At Monday, February 05, 2007 2:03:00 PM, Blogger LawDog said...

Between you and your dad, the two of you can't come up with one beater .22 rifle or pistol?

At Monday, February 05, 2007 4:59:00 PM, Blogger Matt G said...

LD, I'm trying to skirt the concept of bringing in extra guns into the car. (What've we got now? 5?) That means another qualification, if we're playing by the rules. Also, .22 pistols can be pretty loud, too, as you know, for questionable knockdown power. There's a particular 50lb feral dog that's been running around the city biting at people that has a "shoot on sight" order. I got two chances yesterday, but passed them up because of the noise factor (behind a couple of frame houses on a Sunday afternoon.).

I just ordered a .410 shotshell adaptor, after having had a really nice chat with the proprietor, Tony Trezza for about 45 minutes. Fascinating guy.

If I can get some info on it, I'll try one of the Dina adaptors. The price is good.

At Saturday, February 10, 2007 5:25:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hello-An outfit in Anchorage Alaska makes all kinds of chamber adaptors for rifles and shotguns. (MCA Sports/Ace Bullet Co 907-248-4913) Their web is I enjoy your blog. Sounds like these folks may have somethging that will help you out.

At Tuesday, August 07, 2007 8:33:00 AM, Blogger KD5NRH said...

I'd second the mcace suggestion; if you can get a break-over shotgun, you can shoot nearly anything out of it with their adapters, and I've heard that the 10" .38 adapter in a 20" 20ga barrel is pretty quiet. I'd imagine the .22LR and .22WMR wouldn't be much more than an air rifle noise level, but with better velocity than most pistols due to the 10" barrel.

At Tuesday, October 23, 2007 9:32:00 PM, Blogger Unknown said...

I got a bunch of these on ebay before they got a stick up their ass about gun parts. Both the plastic hi-vels and the aluminum Dina Arms. neatest thing is that they made my old flare gun into a useful derringer. but the real bit is how they work in my Dad's old Coach Gun. Dad is 75 now, and never was the "Mighty Mesomorph" that most shotgunners are. He has a recurring nightmare about touching off that 12 in the front room, and finding himself in the back of the house. I took out the shotgun with .410 adapters and it shot sweet and well behaved. I thought "Ed" had it right when he said the larger barrel wouldn't channel the blast. The truth is brighter. I was able to bust clays quite nicely, and the cheap chinese coach has pleasantly surprised me when I took it out for turkey one fall. Not with the adapters of course. but despite a $199.00 price tag, this 'lil wonder has performed like a champ. Though one year I'm gonna get a muzzle loader expert to do something about the sidelocks. The right is fine, the left has a pull like a sailors haul.

Myself I keep a H&R NEF single shot around for 12 gauge, 45-70, 410, and I'm not sure how many rifle calibers. I have various regular rifles and shotguns, but H&R has never let me down.......

At Wednesday, January 30, 2008 11:08:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Matt,I have 3 conversion adapters in .22 cal, they will cycle through
your 870 with no problems. When using sub-sonic ammo and a M16 muzzle cap over your shotguns muzzle, the only sound heard is the
firing pin striking!

They are made by Dina Arms and sold by Numrich Gun Parts.

Item # 881160 Price is $17.60 EA

Accurate out to 20yds with sights


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